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The Elimination of the Battleship from EVE.

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The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.07 08:18:00 - [1] Originally by: Liang Nuren Hmmm... I have to agree. Here's some thoughts (a few more than I originally estimated!): - BCs deliver near BS performance at a fraction of the price (BS modules cost more than Cr modules) - BCs deliver near BS performance at a fraction of the SP - BCs are much more mobile than BS's - which enormously helps both offense and defense - BCs lock much faster than BS's. - Cap/Supercap proliferation make it stupid to field a BS fleet. - Cap/Supercap proliferation make it generally redundant to field a BS because they do more damage and have much larger tanks. They're also significantly more mobile than a BS. Basically it boils down to mobility. Battleships don't have it, and they don't bring much more to the table than the things that do have it. -Liang Yes the BS is in general to slow/lacks agility to be a real predator to the BC class(with 1-2 exceptions). Biggest issue for me on the other hand is the very poor ability to project dps against sub BS sized targets, where the BC performs a lot better. Especially at close range the difference is extreme, even vs BCs. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.08 12:37:00 - [2] Originally by: James Lyrus Now there's a thought. How about a siege module for battleships? Something similar - but maybe not quite the same - as the dread ones. That gives a significant boost to tank/gank, but inhibits movement. Or maybe just 'warping', because lets face it, BS ain't that fast anyway. Well given how popular it is to siege a dread and get hotdroped I don't think this really would be this adorable. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.09 09:51:00 - [3] Originally by: James Lyrus Originally by: The Djego Originally by: James Lyrus Now there's a thought. How about a siege module for battleships? Something similar - but maybe not quite the same - as the dread ones. That gives a significant boost to tank/gank, but inhibits movement. Or maybe just 'warping', because lets face it, BS ain't that fast anyway. Well given how popular it is to siege a dread and get hotdroped I don't think this really would be this adorable. It would give battleships something else they could do though. And certainly, a hot drop is a hazard, but is it really any worse than battleships running into a bubble? Bubble -> Cyno ... who cares if they're 'sieging' or not? Make it a lighter form of siege module, and you at least give them active tank and enough firepower to be a threat to said hot drop though. And yes, I know 'most' hot drops are overkill or they just don't bother, but that's not really the point now, is it? Well ofc you are right if you are trapped already it doesn't make a significant difference, and yes the idea would have some merit. However in bigger fights I doubt that the gain in active tank makes a real difference(it hardly makes it for Dreads) and might lead to bigger problems for low sec and small gang BS use by serious increasing the amount of force required to bring them down, what would only lead into more blobbing in the end. In general I would like to see the BS pvp becoming a bit more dynamic again, less restricted and more as a all out combat platform in close range fits. The positive points I see in it, at least for Low Sec, is that it might drive down the BC population a bit, what makes flying Cruisers and HACs more sensible again and promotes overall more use of larger hulls what leads to more fighting, since they are plain easier to catch. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.09 11:27:00 - [4] Edited by: The Djego on 09/12/2010 11:27:32 Originally by: Furb Killer You mean less fighting since losses are more expensive and new players first need a t2 BS before they can be competetive. And more one sided ganks because they are easier to catch. Yes I agree that the inability to use cruisers, since any BC is nearly as fast and got twice the EHP and at least 50% more DPS without any particular price increase or drawbacks is kind of bad for new players and force anybody to skill up and fly more expensive BCs if they don't like frigs. The argument that you need a T2 fitted BS for PVP to be competitive is years old, and outside of the sniping fleets of the old, it never was true. And the primary reason you see 9/10 times one sided fights is that 9/10 of the players wouldn't engage in a even fight. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.11 19:20:00 - [5] Originally by: Ling Vyr BS are not the tool for hit and run games (solo pvp) and have good purpose in fleet figths. Wrong. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.13 02:30:00 - [6] Originally by: Ephemeron Originally by: Reaver Glitterstim Edited by: Reaver Glitterstim on 12/12/2010 22:51:04 Uh-oh it looks like somebody is unhappy his solopwnmobile got nerfed. l2p noob and get more than 1 ship. [Edit]and don't take my battleships away from me! Ability of 1 player to beat superior forces by use of tactics and specialized equipment is what drives people to excel in the game. It promotes elite players, allows "heroes" to exist. When you need a gang to achieve anything great in PvP, you are just a pawn, easily replaceable by any other nameless pawn. This. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.15 01:59:00 - [7] Originally by: Emperor Cheney When you say "cruiser" what are you talking about exactly? t3? hac? Because I really can't afford a t3 (enter botting joke here), and I don't fly a vaga, so that's a bit weak. Mate, you need to bring the BS, not the cruiser. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.15 02:05:00 - [8] Edited by: The Djego on 15/12/2010 02:05:50 Originally by: Emperor Cheney Edited by: Emperor Cheney on 15/12/2010 02:00:59 Originally by: The Djego Originally by: Emperor Cheney When you say "cruiser" what are you talking about exactly? t3? hac? Because I really can't afford a t3 (enter botting joke here), and I don't fly a vaga, so that's a bit weak. Mate, you need to bring the BS, not the cruiser. Oh I know, I'm just seeing a whole lot of ways for optimal skeeziness on his end here. There are obviously a whole lot of cruiser hulls that can beat 99% of bs's in a staged one on one, unless fitted in some crazy fashion. Some random BS against any and all cruiser hulls where he obviously has pretty much unlimited ISK and SP is giving him all the advantages. Mate use full honor, like any skilled BS pilot does and bring your preferred cookie cuter BS to pawn this little cruiser. You can check the KBs of real low Sec dwellers what they use and what satisfies all her "I pawned this cruiser with my BS!" needs. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.15 02:17:00 - [9] Originally by: Emperor Cheney Originally by: The Djego Mate use full honor, like any skilled BS pilot does and bring your preferred cookie cuter BS to pawn this little cruiser. You can check the KBs of real low Sec dwellers what they use and what satisfies all her "I pawned this cruiser with my BS!" needs. honor! A fast kiting ship pretty obviously has the edge in a one on one against pretty much any bs. You really fly a blaster BS? If so, I'm speechless. This is hilarious behind believe. Originally by: Emperor Cheney Is the idea that somewhere I said battleships are best for everything everywhere always? Because that's almost the opposite of what I said anywhere here. A one on one is an extremely staged circumstance in which fringe fittings thrive. I've said numerous times, here, that battleships shouldn't be deployed solo. I'm not knocking it at all, but after a whole thread talking about nullsec and lowsec fights, to suddenly make blind 1 v 1 the ultimate measure of a ship is, well, kind of silly. Take it from someone that still flies BS solo, you fail. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.15 02:39:00 - [10] Originally by: Emperor Cheney Originally by: The Djego You really fly a blaster BS? If so, I'm speechless. This is hilarious behind believe. http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=7521306 ? There is sometimes a moment in your live you want to believe it is still there(this might involve huge amounts of emoventism, balls and alcohol but yeah this is what blaster pvp was all about anyway). It also might have included a Web that didn't manage to hold the target in place and more than one neut on the gedon. Originally by: Emperor Cheney But I'm not sure what this has to do with anything. I don't even know what "behind believe" means. I wasn't talking about a blaster BS necessarily, because tracking exists - I don't even know what you're talking about at all. Topics I was talking about 1) Battleships and their role in lowsec and nullsec 2) HONOURE DULES OF HONOUR What is funny since you started to smack about CAOD **, that doesn't belong in a thread outside of CAOD and honestly not even in a thread in CAOD. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by:** Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.

The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.15 03:01:00 - [11] Edited by: The Djego on 15/12/2010 03:09:32 Edited by: The Djego on 15/12/2010 03:04:59 Originally by: Emperor Cheney Originally by: The Djego What is funny since you started to smack about CAOD **, that doesn't belong in a thread outside of CAOD and honestly not even in a thread in CAOD. DBH dogged on me pretty much out of nowhere, so I dogged on him back. Then he melted down completely. I mean come on, that's at least kind of entertaining. You don't need to defend FW on the forums, everyone knows it is rather questionable as far as tactics and involved pvpers go by the nature of the system itself. This is nothing personal, just the way it is. Make a point about BS balance, prove it with the epic BC stats of your main and your corp if you like and feel it would add extra wight to your argument(in most cases it doesn't, but it is nice to see where people coming from to understand he POV better) or leave it be, but don't smack people because you feel like it would add something to the thread(it doesn't add anything). ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by:** Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.15 12:07:00 - [12] Originally by: Calapine BS ARE the largest 'normal' shiptype and should be there to fulfill peoples "I want to fly a large, powerful behemoth space ship" sf-nerd-urges. If they feel big and unwieldy that's just right. Actually if people got this urges they just could fit a few 1600mm on her BC. For more reasonable people the BS is a tool to get certain jobs done, like any ship class in eve, and this job shouldn't be limited to immobile brick with lacking damage projection, sniping stuff at 200km, PVE or POS/Cap basher. Originally by: Calapine If you think they are currently 'underpowered' and laking distinction compared the current Tier 2 BC lineup, I'd rather see improvents in raw dps and tank, while leaving tracking and mobility unchanged (therefore preventing the dreaded solopwnmobile). That would be pretty cool, however I think having a BS to shot BS is kind of pointless. Mobility and damage projection is what they need to become more attractive again for common field use, since this are the main two points where they lack to much compared to BCs today. The only time, the BS where a solopawnmobiles was around the time where they went 4-6km/s, killed your cap with Nos, handed out 70km bumps and couldn't be effectively stopped by webs by her sheer mass and speed(basically the first nano BS of the old). Outside of this they where the heavy front line ship, easy to tackle and shoot, but not to limited in her ability to return fire and catching stuff. Plus they where actually a true predator to the BC class, like the BC is to cruisers this days. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
The Djego Minmatar Hellequin Inc.	Posted - 2010.12.19 19:57:00 - [13] Originally by: Omara Otawan Originally by: Liang Nuren Pray tell what the statistics are for small gang combat. Its overall, so that includes small gang combat. As for a specific small gang combat statistic, I dont have one, but one can only hope that its a lot more towards the smaller hulls there. Unless we want to advocate increased capital usage in small gang combat at the same time I doubt this(it is like 10 bcs per BS), and we run very BS heavy down here. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank! Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.

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